User talk:Blue Rook/Archive 10

Welcome to my Talk page, 24 fans!
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Main cast
A couple of notes from me waiting for you there. 20:22, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

Renee main image
Posted some possibles for you. 21:22, 29 May 2009 (UTC)

Protocol instead of Policies
Do you think that the policies page on the nav bar should be changed to protocol? You hear the word protocol used on 24 more often than policies, so it would sound better. --Tommer419 00:34, 30 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Just so you know, Tommer, this would be a community decision, not an administrator decision, so it should be proposed in The Situation Room rather than on a User talk page. That said, I think it's a neat idea which would fit with other terminology like "Latest intel," "Random data" and "The Bullpen". --proudhug 03:18, 30 May 2009 (UTC)


 * This is actually a cool idea, I agree as well. I might propose it more formally in the forum if nobody beats me to it. But it would only affect the nav-bar in monaco (meaning, we wouldn't be moving the policies page to a new name or anything). 23:33, 2 June 2009 (UTC)

RE: Actor articles
Ah, so I can just use an in-character image for the actors? I'll continue doing it that way, then. One question, though, out of curiosity, why can't we use IMDb pictures?--Citizen91 20:08, 14 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Hopefully Rook won't mind if I respond... the reason we can't use IMDb images is because we don't have the rights to use them. Our fairuse template only covers pics that are from within the show, and not photos/screencaps that aren't from 24. Hopefully that answers your question. In short; we don't want to get sued for using an image we don't have copyright for! -- SignorSimon (talk/contribs/email) 20:12, 14 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Crystal clear.--Citizen91 20:32, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Though, sometimes actor images can be used from official Fox behind-the-scenes footage from DVD features or other 24-related shows. That's where all our crew pics come from. --proudhug 21:07, 14 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Thanks for fielding that one Simon while I was out :) And yes Citizen as Proudhug mentions, if you find a good image of an actor (not just crew, as is currently most common) from behind-the-scenes footage (or other 24-related FOX content) then they are good to include as well. It's just less common, so we generally go for the default of an in-character image. 00:46, 15 June 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for all the pointers, guys. Something that's been bugging me, is it really necessary to add additional career information to the actor articles (for minor cast members, at least) or can I just fill out what the actor template asks for? I know what the answer is going to be, but I just want to check if what I'm doing with each actor page is acceptable either way.--Citizen91 01:56, 15 June 2009 (UTC)


 * By "additional career information" do you mean a sentence or two about their other projects that include fellow 24 actors? If so, then, no, you aren't obligated to do that at all. It's just helpful content that is really good to include in actor bios (someone else will want do it eventually if you choose not to, though). If, by "additional career information", you mean the Selected filmography list, then again this isn't really necessary but a very consistent thing to include. Films/shows that are safe to include there are: anything popular or well-known, anything that said actor had a major role in, anything that is thematically related to 24 (cops shows, action stuff), and any show or film that has featured other 24 actors. I personally exclude items from the filmog that are obscure, unpopular, or foreign films, if they already fail to meet the inclusion criteria above. 18:34, 15 June 2009 (UTC)


 * What I meant was the kind of additional information you'd see on pages like Kiefer Sutherland and Kim Raver, although I can see how minor actors (which consist of all the cast-related redlinks left) wouldn't explicitly need that kind of additional info. on their pages. I'll continue creating these articles the way I've been doing, then.--Citizen91 18:52, 15 June 2009 (UTC)

Another wiki editor deleted an entire biography I wrote for a guest actor. Is that permitted? See Talk:Michael Shanks --DeeKayP 02:56, September 11, 2009 (UTC)

signatures
how do you make a signature, like the one blue rook has? --Ianwwenhl10 22:51, 18 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Heya Ian, my bad about the delay on the response to this one. To make a sig, simply put the code for your sig into a new, independent page in your user namespace (something with the suffix like /Sig is generally a good choice), and then transclude it as a template onto the end of your posts. You transclude by linking to the page in between double curly brackets, like the Fairuse template, for example. Then, type 5 tildes to timestamp it (as opposed to the default sig, which is four tildes). 18:11, 8 August 2009 (UTC)

Please help
Hey, I'm the IP from the terrorist attacks on 24 talk page. I'm attempting to create an account but whenever Ip click the bg green botton I go straight to wikia help. Could you please post me the link to the correct page? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 86.44.220.199 on 14:47, 2009 August 8


 * Try this link here, let me know if it works! If you get the account, remember to wait a day or two for more input on your suggested page move before you perform the operation, others might have some ideas too. 18:54, 8 August 2009 (UTC)

The link worked, thanks! I was just suggesting the change, I don't want to be too pushy or anything! I'm under the name User:Mandylicous now!


 * Glad to see it worked! And no worries about that page, I didn't think you were being pushy at all. Even if you were, sometimes that's how things need to get changed in a wiki. Remember to sign your posts when you go on a talk page by typing four tildes (~) in a row. I hope you enjoy editing! 19:20, 8 August 2009 (UTC)

President links
I think almost everybody in this world knows what the term "President" means, so it really isn't necessary to have the term President separated from the character's name in the show. (e.x. President David Palmer is perfectly fine, and President David Palmer is also fine but since everybody knows what President means President David Palmer would be all that is necessary. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Colton hockey11 on 23:38, 2009 August 14


 * It isn't a matter of if everyone knows what President means or not, it's a matter of precedent. We don't cram titles into links directly to character articles when those titles have separate articles of their own at this wiki. A few examples of that still exist, but they should always link directly to the separate articles. As a compromise, what do you say we delete all the references to President/VP altogether? I'll just go through and delete all the titles, leaving names only for everyone.  01:56, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

No leave the titles. I was just giving my opinion on the subject, it really doesn't matter to me. But keep the titles because it defines the characters.


 * Alrighty, kind of like we have for Admiral John Smith, the titles can stick around. 14:37, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

Flashforward wiki
I'm not sure if I'm right, if its allowed, or if anyone here really cares but I think [http://flashforward.wikia.com. flashforward wiki] stole your skin.-2Anthony416:22, September 11, 2009 (UTC)


 * I noticed that the other day. It is a pretty sweet skin, so who can blame them? --proudhug 23:16, September 11, 2009 (UTC)


 * Speaking of which, where can I change the skin or the main logo of a wiki? Not this one, but I'm contributing to a wiki where I'm basically the sole contributor (or at least, the only frequent one) and I'd like to know where I can change that stuff. Thief12 16:10, October 5, 2009 (UTC)


 * The main logo is almost always located at File:Wiki.png. If you try that and it is actually different on your wiki, let me know I can take a look. Generally, it's protected, do you have admin access? 18:17, October 5, 2009 (UTC)


 * The logo worked, but what about the skin, background and that stuff? I don't have admin access, but there seems to be nobody else around so I don't know who to contact. During the last month, only one other editor has stepped in to make a small edit. In case you want to take a look, it's the Shield wiki. Thief12 02:36, October 6, 2009 (UTC)


 * The skin and content like that is stored in the MediaWiki messages, for example MediaWiki:Monaco.css and MediaWiki:Common.js. The problem is (as you can infer from browsing my meager edits in the MediaWiki namespace at this wiki over in the user contribs feature) that I barely have a clue how MediaWiki works. Almost all of my work in MediaWiki is just copying and pasting altered stuff or plugging in things for people. I'd like to recommend you ask around for help with MediaWiki, then talk with Kanamekun, get a nomination from him for adminship, and approach Wikia Community Staff to be appointed since the only bureaucrat on that wiki seems to have left. Then you can get in there and edit those messages for cool skins! 03:32, October 6, 2009 (UTC)

Calendars
Hey man, do you have the 24 calendars? I was just thinking, the dates in my are very UK-centred (e.g. St. George's Day and stuff like that). I was wondering if you could have a look over the "Notable dates" sections of yours and see if they are different. It could be an interesting thing to note on the episode pages. Cheers! -- SignorSimon (talk/contribs/email) 10:54, December 8, 2009 (UTC)


 * Unfortunately I don't own it... If I ever see one somewhere I will definitely remember to check into it though man. The bookstore where I work in the mornings doesn't sell it. 22:46, December 8, 2009 (UTC)

I have some questions
Hello Blue Rook, my name is Station7 and I'm new on this site. I have a question. Could I make a page for Cast crossovers, because I see several things, where I could make a page from. I don't know much about 24, but that will coming. My motto is: Help the community. I love everything that I see on this page, it's looks perfect. Great, from Station7.--Station7 20:36, January 9, 2010 (UTC)


 * Pages are definitely welcome for cast crossovers in the User namespace at this wiki. Others have proposed a Main namespace page about this content but that is beyond the scope of this project's purview. But you're welcome to do anything 24-related in user space. The only other restriction that applies is that you do it in the minimal number of edits; recently you made something like 20 saves to the same page in rapid succession in about an hour. The problem there is that it floods the Recent intel/Latest changes Special page and is a policy violation, so in the future please just use the Show Preview button as many times as needed instead! 02:08, January 10, 2010 (UTC)

Sorry for that, I forget sometimes things and that's not with a purpose. But I will doing my best!--Station7 10:50, January 10, 2010 (UTC)

Could you help me with Cast crossovers, it didn't work so far, a link to the wikipedia. Thank you.--Station7 11:41, January 10, 2010 (UTC)


 * I'd be happy to help. The first things I had to do were policy-related matters. First, the two images you uploaded were not 24-related, which is a violation of our image policy, so I had to delete them. We don't accept any images that aren't from (or directly related to) the show 24, unless it's a single personal image for a qualified contributor's personal user page. Second, the page was located in the Main namespace. This is what I mentioned in my previous post, so I moved it to your namespace at User:Station7/Cast crossovers.
 * You'll be happy to know that several other users have similar pages in their namespaces too. Check out User:Thief12/Lost24, User:RyanGibsonStewart, and User:Ianwwenhl10/Psych24. You can learn how to link to Wikipedia by reading here, and you can also link to images outside the wiki in your userspace as well (so long as they're appropriate). 15:44, January 10, 2010 (UTC)

Sorry for that again! But when could you put something like that on the 24-Wikia? Or is this a progress that's over when 24 is over, we could put in on the site? I have much to learn, because all the Wikia's are different. I hope you understand that, and that's not rude to you or the other administrators. I'm from The Netherlands!--Station7 17:32, January 10, 2010 (UTC)

This page is for an...
Hey, I was wondering if you could get into Common.js (or wherever this is defined) and change the "Actor" default page so TV shows are in italics rather than quotation marks, like you were talking about in the forum. That should at least stop people from making Season 8 actor pages incorrectly. --Pyramidhead 22:29, January 16, 2010 (UTC)


 * Found what you meant; done. As far as the bot goes, is this something we can change retroactively for all the other actor pages? Damn now I feel like a tool for "correcting" those in the past. 00:06, January 17, 2010 (UTC)

Also, when you get the chance, fix the episode naming on the "Character" default page (add quotes and the colon). I've had to fix every new character page that I didn't create myself. --Pyramidhead 07:24, January 18, 2010 (UTC)

Nice meeting you
Hi. Thanks for the warm welcome. I've never been a part of any wiki before, let alone one of my own show! Could you help me with editing my signature? I also was wondering, since I am an actress from 24, if it was okay if I edited my own actress page. Thank you again for your welcome, --Mary Lynn Rajskub 01:43, January 26, 2010 (UTC)


 * I'm pretty sure I was here for quite awhile before changing from the default signature. I wanted to get the editing down pat first :) But if you have questions your best bet is to link to the kind of signature you like, and I can help you sort out how to edit it to your liking. Also, anything about Mary Lynn Rajskub that can be verified with an official source — and which relates to her 24 work — is welcome on the actress page (otherwise we wouldn't know if it was fabricated). Now, if you really are who you say you are, you can understand why I'd be a little skeptical! But I won't ask for proof of who you are, since all 24 enthusiasts are welcome.. just be ready to verify anything you post here like the rest of the editing community. 04:59, January 30, 2010 (UTC)

Jack Bauer
On Jacks page it says he was in the Special Forces and The Delta Force, I was just wondering where we found all that out.
 * Heya there, I already answered over on User talk:99.71.146.164. Check out the bottom part, much of the information comes from the 24 novels. Now, I'm a 24 purist and personally only take the television show as canon, but this project here respects all the official 24 publications as canonical too, which is why that information is included. 04:50, January 30, 2010 (UTC)

RE:Templates
OK, I will doing that. --Station7 20:24, February 19, 2010 (UTC)

Kavita Patil
Could you please delete the page from Kavita Patil. There is no proof that zsshe appears in the serie. But the actress looked a lot like her.--Station7 13:11, February 22, 2010 (UTC)


 * I've done it. -- SignorSimon (talk/contribs/email) 14:05, February 22, 2010 (UTC)

Thanks ;) --Station7 14:16, February 22, 2010 (UTC)

Link to "next time on 24" video?
Do you think that we should put a link on the Next template to a preview of next week's episode of 24? I found this on Youtube and there are several others. I can almost guarentee one will be uploaded each week. I thought it might be a good idea, but wasn't sure since I'm new? Here's what it could look like:

24 returns in...

Click for preview (contains spoilers)

Thanks Noahcs 02:53, February 24, 2010 (UTC)


 * Thank you for running this by before posting it! Because this project has always been specifically structured to be accessible to everyone who likes 24, including those who hate spoilers about upcoming episodes, we have a strict spoiler policy that precludes anything being posted from unaired episodes. The previews are 100% spoilers, so we can't include content or links to them. It's a good idea certainly, just not available to this project. 03:04, February 24, 2010 (UTC)


 * OK. Noahcs 03:08, February 24, 2010 (UTC)

Questions
Hey Rook!

I've kinda fallen out of the official Wikia helpers group due to an exponential increase in responsibilities in real life. So what I'm gonna do is refer your questions to the Entertainment head honcho. His name is Scott, and his handle is Scarecroe.

I honestly took a shot at answering your questions, but didn't know any more about the answer than you did. I didn't even know auto-welcomes were gone!

Sorry I couldn't be more help, I hope to rejoin the helper group in the future when I get a little more free time on my hands. As it is, I'll have to be happy as a lowly Administrator. ;)

&mdash; Nathan (Peteparker) (Earth-1218) (talk &bull; contribs &bull; email) 06:27, March 4, 2010 (UTC)


 * Hey there, Nathan alerted me to your queries, so I thought I'd pop in and do my best to help out.


 * The auto welcomes has a bug that the tech team is trying to track down. It should be working again soon.


 * The diff pages I'm seeing here have white text on a green background. If you want to change that, it should be pretty easy to do by editing MediaWiki:Monaco.css


 * As for customizing the New Article page, I would suggest replying to the Wikia ticket and asking that it be assigned to Danny (Toughpigs). He was in charge of that project and should be able to help you out. —Scott ( talk ) 01:45, March 5, 2010 (UTC)

Unnamed CTU agents
Sorry about that editing conflict we just had. I had realized that Kaitlyn Benson was the blonde agent but was in the middle of uploading the pics for all unnamed CTU characters and creating the articles when my wife asked me to do the dishes. Sorry, but she's boss, hahaha... anyway, I tried to merge what I already had. Thief12 04:15, March 25, 2010 (UTC)


 * My bad actually, I didn't realize you were working away at them at the moment! But hey excellent work despite the overlap. I love the shots you got of Henderson (especially), Beck, & Blochard, and good work with Combs too (too bad they didn't look at him much). It's great when the camera lingers on the minor characters. 04:22, March 25, 2010 (UTC)

Categories
Perhaps I should've ask you this a long time before but, I've noticed you usually jump into character and actor pages I create to fix the categories. When I check the "History", I usually see you adding the category with the actor/character last name and what not (Season 8 actors: Doe, John). However, I was wondering because whenever I create an actor/character page, I always use the category that appears automatically when I choose an actor/character page, which reads "Day X characters" and when I click it, a small screen pops up where I always write the last name and first name (Doe, John). Is this not working? Just wondering because I can save you a lot of work if I learn how to do it correctly, instead of doing it a way that apparently isn't working. Thief12 19:34, March 27, 2010 (UTC)


 * Yes man I'm very glad you asked me about this. I've been wanting to mention it, but was afraid that it would come off the wrong way, like I was giving "orders" or having undue expectations, despite however carefully I might have worded it. To get to the nitty gritty about the categs, I think it's fair to say that Wikia's category feature is really buggy or something. I remember being very frustrated with it and I turned it off in Preferences, under Editing tab (Disable Category Select), to never see it again. Instead you can just manually insert the categs. For me, I have a text file open in the background constantly, and I just have it ready to copy and paste stuff, like these categs, whenever necessary. When you make a new actor page, you might find this method pretty good. Just look to see how the actor was credited (guest star, or co-star usually) and insert it between the other two categories.

[[Category:Actors|           ---AND: [[Category:Co-stars|          ---OR: [[Category:Guest stars|       ---AND: [[Category:Season 8 actors|   ---OR: [[Category:Uncredited actors|


 * Something like that is perfect. The hardest part is typing Lastname, Firstname after the pipe but it's more annoying than anything. And bang, you're done! 06:22, March 28, 2010 (UTC)


 * Ok, I'll be sure to remember that! and don't let yourself be afraid to ask the next time :-) Thief12 14:39, March 28, 2010 (UTC)


 * Sure bro! Also I forgot to mention that the categs are very sensitive: (1) only 1 space can be in there after the pipe (it goes right after the comma following the surname... if the actor has one or more middle name(s), it just gets typed directly after the firstname; and (2) only 2 capital letters are allowed in the name (simply the first letter of the surname and first name).
 * As I'm typing this I'm correcting a bunch of incorrectly categorized actor pages with the example of the "Mc" Irish prefix in surnames. Since the alphabetization system here happens to be automatically case sensitive (for some reason), we don't capitalize the letter after Mc. 15:02, March 28, 2010 (UTC)


 * Ok, thanks for the help! BTW, I don't know if you're aware but I also found out that, when creating a new actor/character article, on the same bar that that the pre-existing categories appear, there's an option that reads "Code view". If you click it, the bar changes presenting the categories in code just like you like them. I'm using that right now and it's pretty easy. I only mention it because you said that you disabled that bar and you're taking the categories from a text document. Don't know if this would make it easier for you. Thief12 21:08, March 29, 2010 (UTC)

Disambiguating first names
How was that disambiguation policy set? Not disambiguating first names is contrary to both the practice of Wikipedia and the policy of most other serial TV series wikis I'm familiar with. It seems just bad policy. If I type in Samir because I don't know the character's last name, I should have options to direct me to relevant articles. One can't expect people to know every character's last name, especially the last names of minor characters, and especially when that is the name by which the characters are most often referred to on screen.

The policy as it stands is doing harm by making information hard to find, which is contrary to the purpose of the wiki. That such a dab page is something that multiple users feel is necessary is clearly indicated by the fact that that page has been attempted to be created three times now by different editors. The page does no harm and provides benefit.

—WikiaCitizen (reply) 11:58, April 9, 2010 (UTC)


 * Wait a second. If you Search for "Samir", you automatically get options for the relevant articles. I'm not sure why you're so passionate about setting a precedent to create all these unnecessary disambiguation pages when the Wiki presents options by default! Honestly, did you actually try to perform a search for "Samir"?
 * And, regarding where the policy came from, Proudhug put it best at one point: such pages don't disambiguate anything, its just needlessly redundant work. Disambig pages are for names like Yuri, where there is no surname. 03:57, April 10, 2010 (UTC)


 * I'm starting a discussion on this at Wiki 24 talk:Manual of Style. Such articles do disambiguate: "Samir" could refer to either "Samir Mehran" or "Samir Hussain". It doesn't create needless redundant work; if you don't want to create such pages, no one is requiring you to do so. Instead, others like me who run into such instances can create the pages. The needless redundant work is having to do a search instead of having links directing us to the relevant articles. —WikiaCitizen (reply) 23:25, April 11, 2010 (UTC)


 * Thanks for posting a discussion about it, let's see what other folks say. I'll post my reply there. 05:13, April 12, 2010 (UTC)

Somehow, Samier Mehran was removed from "On screen kills by Jack Bauer"--98.80.138.123 02:39, April 11, 2010 (UTC)


 * Replaced it, thanks 98.80.138.123! 16:23, April 11, 2010 (UTC)

How do I make a user page?
I've had a few suggestions that I should make a user page. How do I do that exactly? :-) Hypnometal 03:05, April 14, 2010 (UTC)

I'm happy to hear it! Just go to User:Hypnometal and click Edit, and feel free to be inspired by stuff from other people's user pages. Or you can just rant about the show without any special formatting. Earlier you weren't able to do this without bypassing a redirect to your Talk page, but I just removed the RD. Take your time with it & have fun! 11:09, April 14, 2010 (UTC)

Thanks
Hey bro, thanks for that tip, it actually worked... anyways i also wanted to ask ya how to get recent episode pics of the kills by jack, like where to get it from?


 * Editors take the screens themselves I believe. I don't have the luxury until the DVDs come out so I just wait for other editors to post 'em. Also please note I removed Mullins, the security contractor that Jack knocked out, because I'm 99% certain that the guy wasn't killed. If you believe otherwise of course we can start a discussion on the episode Talk page or template talk. 20:22, May 4, 2010 (UTC)

OOU?
What's OOU? SteveTalk 05:28, May 5, 2010 (UTC)


 * Oou policy as old as the wiki. . . 08:33, May 5, 2010 (UTC)

Blocked?
I receive a message that says my IP was blocked because it was used by another user. The user was JackBauer82. Let me know if you need anything to activate my account again. Thief12 06:04, May 9, 2010 (UTC)
 * I don't know what happened, but I can still edit. Anyway, if you know what happened, let me know. Thief12 06:08, May 9, 2010 (UTC)
 * Haven't a clue. Is there a chance the vandal used your computer or something? Is everything okay now? 13:34, May 9, 2010 (UTC)
 * So far, everything is ok. My computer is personal and only me and my wife use it. Thief12 17:09, May 9, 2010 (UTC)

JavaScript
Hi, apparently the JS to stop the image popups I gave you via irc doesn't work, so you'll prolly want to remove it, in case it breaks something. I'll keep looking for the right way, though-- Austin (Talk) 01:26, May 12, 2010 (UTC)

About Heather Nauert
Is it okay to identify Heather Nauert Norby as playing "herself" during Episode 8x21? Isn't the custom here to identify real-life news reporters as fictitious characters within the 24 universe, even if they're playing similar characters with even the same name? For example, Rick Garcia (character) as opposed to Rick Garcia (actor)... Thief12 02:29, May 12, 2010 (UTC)


 * If you're talking about the disambig tag in the article title, it isn't necessary since her full name wasn't visible on the screen. 03:08, May 12, 2010 (UTC)


 * No, I said it because in the article about the episode, it reads "Heather Nauert Norby as Heather Nauert/herself (live broadcast)". Thief12 03:35, May 12, 2010 (UTC)


 * Ah yeah if that's not standard your can just pull that part down. 03:47, May 12, 2010 (UTC)

Uploads
Would you object me uploading a Spooks split screen screencap and add it in the background notes section of the Split screen article? If I am to make an excuse, it's that I believe the inclusion is encyclopedic. Thanks. -- Matthew R Dunn 15:24, May 17, 2010 (UTC)


 * Noting the similarities between the split screens is encyclopedic but the upload would still be against the image policy (it isn't from 24). There is a way you can link to external images so that it looks like it's been uploaded. Someone did it on their userpage years ago, and it's still around, but there are so many userpages now that I cannot spot which one it was. 16:25, May 17, 2010 (UTC)

my notes on the format of the seasons
why did you remove them, i think they are relevant and neccesary and i think its good to know who was the main antagonist(s) of each season. they are not subjective because the main antagonist of the season is made very clear by the showrunners, for example Stephen Saunders in Season 3, or Victor Drazen in Season 1, or Alan Wilson is Season 7. these men were behind everything that happened during each day therefore are the main antagonists of each season. i dont get why you think my notes are uneccesary, when i think its a great addition to include each season overall main antagonist.(Delta Paradox 19:56, May 19, 2010 (UTC))


 * It's definitely not that simple, except in the case of Season 4 where it is clear that Habib Marwan planned and executed most of the plot himself. What makes someone the "main antagonist"? The guy who planned things? Or the guy who managed most of it? Or the guy that Jack Bauer went up against most of the screen time? Many times, the planner of the conspiracy isn't even seen. You can re-insert those notes but you must use a more descriptive phrase than "main antagonist". There's no simple "main antagonist" for seasons like 6, where Gredenko and Markov were using Fayed as a pawn, but then they were wiped out and the balance of power fell directly to Fayed after that fact... only to have him replaced with Cheng Zhi and Phillip Bauer in an entirely different plot. Run some ideas here and we can sort out the best one, before you reinsert the same stuff. 20:11, May 19, 2010 (UTC)

well how about we include the main antagonist of each act as the overall main antagonists of each season for seasons such as 6 or 2. but for Seasons 1, 7, 8, and 5 im pretty sure its clear who the main antagonists are. how about this

Season 1:- Victor Drazen: he was behind all the other antagonists Season 2:- Peter Kingsley: he was behind the bomb and was the main antagonist in Act 3 Season 3:- Ramon Salazar, Michael Amador, Stephen Saunders: the whole threat of the day had to do with all of them. Season 4:- Habib Marwan: its very clear Season 5:- Vladimir Bierko and Charles Logan: Logan was behind the whole conspiracy and Bierko behind the attacks. Season 6:- Abu Fayed or Dmitri Gredenko, Phillip Bauer and Cheng Zhi. Season 7:- Alan Wilson: i think its pretty clear since he was behind everything that happened. Season 8:- Yuri Suvarov: he was also behind everything that happened.

so what are your thoughts? maybe you have some other ideas. (Delta Paradox 20:21, May 19, 2010 (UTC))


 * I definitely disagree with including this. It doesn't add more to the article than what is being said above in the description of the acts and the listing of the major subplots. Besides, as Blue Rook already said, not every season is as clear-cut as, say, Season 4. So what's the point in complicating the article by putting a single line to say "this character was the main antagonist of this act, but this act the main antagonist was this other character". You also mention several good examples about this. For example, you say Peter Kingsley was the main antagonist of Season 2, but some people would say that Kingsley was a rung or two below Max and Alexander Trepkos, who seem to be the actual masterminds. And Blue Rook might get picky with the unnamed conspirator that was always with Trepkos. Also, Season 5 complicates everything because it's such a "messy" conspiracy. You forgot to mention that Vladimir Bierko sorta double-crossed Logan and went rogue with the Sentox canisters. Plus, Logan was ultimately responding to Graem Bauer and the Bluetooth cabal. And let's not forget Christopher Henderson's crucial involvement in the logistics of everything. All in all, I don't see how this would improve the article further. If anything, it would be either more complicated and/or redundant with what is there already. Thief12 01:24, May 20, 2010 (UTC)


 * I agree with everything Thief12 said. -- SignorSimon (talk/contribs/email) 10:25, May 20, 2010 (UTC)

It's been awhile but it seems 3 editors are actually on the same page about something! Delta Paradox don't be discouraged, everyone has ideas that can't work completely from time to time, and it's worth noting that Season 4 still gets to keep this kind of note. 20:22, May 20, 2010 (UTC)