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Forum: The Situation Room > New Wiki for Indian 24 series

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I believe the new series should have its own Wikia site. New admins, new community, separate homepage, and its own content, color scheme, etc. Anyone else agree we are sort of forcing it to fit among the US series content? Sooner is a better time to start than later. Blue Rook  talk  contribs 05:36, November 24, 2013 (UTC)

I think there's room for both; there might be a little overlap content-wise, e.g. India, but for the most part it will probably be in its own section away from the U.S. stuff. It is, however, probably a good idea to at least hold off on fleshing it out any further until there's a subtitled version (if there ever is). The updates I've made about what characters match which are all from the official site synopses (the same source for the new character pages) and some of them are educated guesses. Might be best to limit the new content to 24 (Indian TV series) and take out the links to the new characters/episodes. --Pyramidhead (talk) 08:03, November 24, 2013 (UTC)
Like earlier said by Acer4666 that we could use templates on the pages of 24 (Indian TV series) character pages. --Station7 (talk) 09:57, November 24, 2013 (UTC)
Do we know with certainty that it takes place in a different universe than the US series? Even if it does, plenty of other wikis have no problem distinguishing between different continuities within the same franchise. I see no reason to include any and all information from the Indian series here as well as the original series. It's an official 24 product and as such deserves to be included here. --proudhug (talk) 04:34, November 27, 2013 (UTC)
This means we are asserting that the events of Day 1 in LA, also occurred in India, with the only difference being the people look different and stuff has different names. Pretty much, right? Don't you see how ridiculous that sounds? The problem is that we, this particular community, have always thrown everything into the same continuity with a handful of rare exceptions (primarily limited to deleted TV scenes and blatantly retconned spin-offs). I wouldn't have an issue with this if we hadn't been so opposed to recognizing separate continuities in the past. Blue Rook  talk  contribs 05:43, November 27, 2013 (UTC)
Whether it's in the same "universe" is beside the point; it's a retelling of a previous story that's not likely to intersect with the existing setting or characters in any way. (At least not until Kiefer does his cameo, and who knows what that would do.) The more I think about it, though, there are a number of pages that would become rather messy - do we want to have to basically copy-paste entire sections of Mole or Interrogation with the names changed as the new show catches up? I already dislike splitting articles into "Day X" headings; doing the same thing for separate continuities will be a nightmare. Of course, it's all moot until an English-subbed version is made available, unless anyone here speaks Hindi. --Pyramidhead (talk) 07:07, November 27, 2013 (UTC)
I think we shouldn't have too much of a problem keeping things here. Lots of other franchises have wikis that encompass their whole universe of films, shows, etc. regardless of how "well" they integrate (or not) with each other. As long as we figure an organic way to discern some articles from others, I don't think there should be a problem. An idea was thrown around a couple of weeks ago that mentioned using a specific banner/header, whether on top of the page, or maybe within the infoboxes? to discern what belongs to the original show or to the Indian version. Thief12 (talk) 01:10, November 28, 2013 (UTC)
I might be being really annoying here but I think this indian remake is (kind of) comparable to the show being dubbed in different languages. The French wiki 24 uses the dubbed show as canon, so anything said by the French actors is what happened. Presumably there are slight differences in the dialogue, which could be noted here but not worked into the in-universe continuity. I mean it seems to be a direct re-telling of the Day 1 storyline right? Just translated across for Indian audiences. Trying to work it together seems wrong. Perhaps a separate namespace? Or a visual clue like a banner what Thief said--Acer4666 (talk) 13:59, November 28, 2013 (UTC)
It's not quite a remake; the political story is completely new and seems to tie into the main plot more than Palmer's adventure in Season 1, plus Jack has a son as well as a daughter. That's one point in favor of covering it, but I still worry that it might lead to some redundancy on the broader articles. --Pyramidhead (talk) 20:59, November 28, 2013 (UTC)
While it is pretty insane for it to be a remake for the most part, one could also take into account that Jai Singh Rathod may simply be just a man with a similar background as Bauer's.--Gunman6 (talk) 07:38, December 14, 2013 (UTC)
Alright, I have to say I'm not happy with the articles for the new Indian series characters. Bad enough that they're just copy-pasted from the official site, but - again - it is literally not feasible to expand them any further without an English version available. Anyone else in favor of redirecting them to 24 (Indian TV series)#Cast for now? If we ever decide to revisit they'll still be in the page history. --Pyramidhead (talk) 18:34, December 28, 2013 (UTC)
I wouldn't say it's not feasible to expand them until an english versin is released - all it would take is an editor who is familiar with the storyline of the indian show. Just because we don't currently have an editor like that shouldn't affect decisions on how to handle the indian show here on the wiki - redirecting all the articles I think would put off any potential editors who could help.
(Certainly remove or re-write any copy-pasted text, though).
The real issue here is that we need to come to a decision on how to deal with the in-universe information from the indian show. There's clearly a problem in mixing it together, especially as many articles would cover things from both american and indian versions. As I see it, the options are:
  1. Treat the two shows as happening in the same universe. As I said before, I don't think this is a good idea and I think it's tantamount to trying to fit the foreign language dubbed shows into the continuity as well.
  2. Admit we're dealing with two continuities, and for articles like India or interrogation, split the page into two sections with clearly marked "american" and "indian" versions. I think this would be quite confusing and would spoil some of the good pages by repeating information twice.
  3. Set up a different namespace for all the 24 india stuff, and have separate articles like "24 India:Interrogation" which can then be linked to within the wiki. This would require staff help probably, but it's been done before for the quotes namespace.
  4. Set up a new wiki, with similar theming to this one, treated as a kind of "sister wiki" or whatever, about the indian show, and link to the pages there from this wiki.
I would be in favour of option 3 or 4 from these--Acer4666 (talk) 18:55, December 28, 2013 (UTC)
I think I've come all the way around from option 1 to option 4. There's just so much that's going to be overlapping and contradicting that it's not worth the effort to sort out - plus I don't know if the interest level is there among the predominantly non-Hindi speaking editor base to really do it justice. Doing some weird thing with the namespaces would be no better; we'd end up looking like the Unofficial Elders Scrolls Pages which I personally can't stand. I would just wait and see if somebody does make a new wiki, whether somebody here or elsewhere, then link to that for in-depth info. For now, I think the focus should be on building out 24 (Indian TV series) and describing it in relation to the original series. --Pyramidhead (talk) 19:25, December 28, 2013 (UTC)
Anyone can enhance the Indian show, it's descriptions or the character's backstory at any time if they feel like the online version's descriptions don't suffice. Regardless of it's availability, I don't see how that warrants creating a separate wikia when one could just simply not edit/provide information to that section if they find it too confusing. Also, if the character of Jack Bauer does appear on the Indian version, it's going to seem silly linking back and forth between the two wikias.
Just treat it like the books, The Rookie, game or comics where it's a stand-alone spin-off. Saying it should be separate because it's not available to the masses just comes off as too subjective. Plus, if you separate it from the main wikia, interest will vary; I have seen Memory Alpha do this with it's fan wikia and canon wikia and the latter appears to be getting more editors and treating the other wikia as outsiders. Aside from the questionable treatment, less people would possibly be likely to set up and run the different wikia given it's current region availability.
Last of all, it's not like this was a random spin-off done with permission from the studios or without the original creator's knowledge. Howard Gordon himself gave Anil Kapoor the right contacts to talk to because he fully supported the actor wanting to do his own version of the show. --Gunman6 (talk) 19:49, December 28, 2013 (UTC)
Gunman, I can't tell which of the 4 options you are arguing for. Do you think the continuities should be treated as taking place in the same universe; or do you accept that they are in different universes but want all articles to be on this wiki?--Acer4666 (talk) 19:57, December 28, 2013 (UTC)
Sorry this isn't ringing clear. While I could care less either way as to whether it's in the same universe canon or not (I'm not the creators so it's not my place to decide), I am for the latter option since I feel that is for the best.--Gunman6 (talk) 20:12, December 28, 2013 (UTC)
The core problem is that, currently, only a select number of people - those who can understand the dialogue - are capable of contributing in any meaningful way. For instance, the political plot line is completely new. Something about "St. Stephens" and a graduation? Good luck trying to figure out what that's about just by the episode summaries! It's basically putting a huge chunk of new content in the hands of a few with no way of verifying what parts are true or false. So much effort has been devoted to preventing exactly that situation from happening again - just look at the Zoltan mess, and that was something from the U.S. show! I'm opposed to covering both series on here, but really, the entire discussion shouldn't even happen until everyone is capable of contributing on an even playing field. Just my opinion. --Pyramidhead (talk) 20:14, December 28, 2013 (UTC)
Again, my two cents, I don't see how because it's limited in terms of available editors will help change any progress by forming a separate wikia. It's almost like if one were to divide the Lord of the Rings wikia and form a separate The Hobbit wikia due to some considering the new trilogy adaptation separate canon. It really doesn't make much sense when they're related one way or another.
We're still trying to find out unknown actors on the original show as it is so I think with given time, we can get most everything all sorted out here on the Indian version. We still don't have all the information for all the books, the official game or The Rookie come to think of it. Should those get their separate wikias because they have a limited access to a certain amount of people?--Gunman6 (talk) 20:45, December 28, 2013 (UTC)
No, the wiki isn't comprehensive yet, and it probably never will be. But that's only because nobody's put in the effort - you could buy all the books on Amazon right now and be reading them on a Kindle within five minutes. The same can't be said of this series, which - as far as anyone knows - may not get an English release at all. It seems to be doing gangbusters in India, so there is interest somewhere, but it's essentially off-limits to us for the time being because there isn't a legal, understandable means of consuming it and documenting what's in it on the wiki. --Pyramidhead (talk) 21:00, December 28, 2013 (UTC)
I get where you're going with this but regardless of whether it gets a Region 1 or 2 release, I don't see how making it be on a separate wikia will do anything for anyone. If it never gets available in any fashion, it can just be left as is for now on the wikia. Better to be safe than sorry isn't it?--Gunman6 (talk) 21:14, December 28, 2013 (UTC)
Absolutely! As I said, I'd prefer to change the new characters to redirects, but otherwise I think the current article is insightful enough without going into too much detail. If someday there is a wide release and there's enough interest, the issue can be revisited. If it came to it, I think I'd be okay with the namespace idea - it would only be on some articles, not on all of them, and it's easier than sticking "(India)" or "(Indian TV series)" after everything. --Pyramidhead (talk) 21:21, December 28, 2013 (UTC)
Actually Gunman6 is right. If we should split the Indian version of 24, so should the Rookie, because that's also a spin-off. However, the 24 Game doesn't, because it's Jack Bauer-related. --Station7 (talk) 21:59, December 28, 2013 (UTC)
It's not at all the same situation - The Rookie, which was directed by the show's DP, makes references up the wazoo to the TV show. One of the villains is the long-lost third Salazar brother. It may not have any of the same characters but it's demonstrably set in the same continuity. --Pyramidhead (talk) 01:38, December 29, 2013 (UTC)
The issue I want to get sorted is where on the canon policy the indian series lies. I believe it is essentially a translation of the first series for foreign audiences, so I would place its standing on the canon scale the same as a foreign dubbed version of the first series. Ie, treat these as separate continuities, and not as canon. This seems to be the feeling of most of the people who've commented on this forum, if I've read that right? Gunman I'm not sure where you stand, but bear in mind we already do this for the french, spanish, dutch, versions of the show. If you peruse any wiki where a foreign remake has happened (the killing/Forbrydelsen, Shameless, Skins, etc) you'll see this is how they deal with it too.
So if we all agree the indian show isn't canon, then there's the issue of whether we introduce information about the second continuity on a separate wiki (as we already do for the french, spanish, dutch versions of the show) or include it here. As Pyramidhead said, the issue with including it here is that none of the administrators or regular contributors are in a position to vet the information. Also, whether the info is on the domain name 24.wikia.com/ or whether it's under a separate "sister" wiki is largely academical, as interwiki-linking can be done easily, but the advantages of a separate wiki are (a) no overlap with article names and need for disambiguation tags and (b) an admin team who are able to understand the subject matter--Acer4666 (talk) 01:22, December 29, 2013 (UTC)
It's disingenuous to put the show on the level of a dub-over. It may be the same basic story, but there are a ton of new story elements that distinguish it, apart from the obvious like different names, antagonists, etc. Not to argue against my own opinion, just putting it out there. --Pyramidhead (talk) 01:42, December 29, 2013 (UTC)
I'm not saying it is on the same level, but I'm saying we treat it as such, as it's in the same ballpark, as a translated version of the show (albeit with more work put in and more storyline differences)--Acer4666 (talk) 01:57, December 29, 2013 (UTC)
Again (and I really won't want to say this to death), regardless of the canon, putting it on a separate wikia will accomplish even less.--Gunman6 (talk) 04:19, December 29, 2013 (UTC)
You say that, but everyone seems to agree the Indian series doesn't fit on the canon policy, and we don't make in-universe articles about things that aren't canon, so the currently the only place allowable to make these pages is on a separate wiki.--Acer4666 (talk) 11:27, December 29, 2013 (UTC)
Here's the problem we've all acknowledged that regardless of the canon, it is connected one way or another whether existing in a totally different canon or actually being related due to Jack Bauer appearing in it. It falls under "Related spin-off" of the Canon policy one way or another, with cast member [[Anil Kapoor] being the clearest example and it once again revolving around a 24-hour scenario.
And no one has said what good a separate wikia will do nor stated why else it has to happen other then that they don't have the means available to edit it right away. I don't see how that's a sound excuse when it's going to be made available one way or another some day; this is like saying that we must move the articles related to Live Another Day on a separate wikia since it's not made consumable to the masses yet.--Gunman6 (talk) 20:25, December 29, 2013 (UTC)
OK so you think the indian series should be canonical under the "related spin-off" section? You seem to be saying this based on the fact Jack Bauer may or may not appear in a future episode at some point. But against that we have the glaring contradication that the events of Day 1 happened in a near identical way to someone in India, which is why we think that it should not be canonical.--Acer4666 (talk) 13:38, January 2, 2014 (UTC)
Well, again, while it may be near in identical, it is still not the same premise as it's been executed differently, the political subplots are changed almost 95% and it fits the related spin-off just like The Rookie, which despite having Salazar names and a few related crew-members, was never made mention of in the main 24 show. Again, who are we to say what is or isn't canon? It just feels to me like we're just trying to determine something for the creators themselves and we always use background notes for inconsistencies should they occur so I think we should make use of that instead of taking a vote on "I do or do not consider this canon, axe it, etc."
We shouldn't have to determine what is or isn't canon when we're not the brains behind this franchise.--Gunman6 (talk) 21:20, January 2, 2014 (UTC)
It is canon for itself... and I would say as a remake it is best to keep it here. As for English audiences getting to see it legitimately, I would say not before Live Another Day has finished transmitting... so late 2014, if at all. Also can I suggest that the similarities and differences section gets moved to another article, please? At the moment, it is a set of humongous unmarked spoilers.

Silent Hunter UK (talk) 12:42, January 11, 2014 (UTC)

Per the spoiler policy everything that has aired is fair game to be included anywhere without warnings. Little harder to judge since it hasn't aired in English, yes, but I don't see where else it could be moved to. I imagine that's what most readers are interested in finding out, anyway. --Pyramidhead (talk) 21:19, January 11, 2014 (UTC)
I'm no expert (nor do I wish to be associated as such) but in the past, I've noticed it's often best to simply reveal material here and there but to stay true to the anti-spoiler policy, it's best to not make note of the various climatic episode twists that are sometimes made apparent earlier in the episode.--Gunman6 (talk) 16:21, January 13, 2014 (UTC)
We can put this in its own article... say Differences between US and Indian versions of ''24''?
Major story differences can be listed on the 24 india page - but trying to make a comprehensive list of every single difference between the two shows would be a futile effort - everything is different, they are different shows!
As for the canon debate, anyone involved in the production of these shows has described it as a "remake". Anil Kapoor bought the "remake rights", and a fox spokesperson said "We hope this will pave the way for many more local versions of this brilliant series in other international territories". It's very clear that the showmakers are not intending this to be part of the same continuity as the english series. We don't have to guess their intentions, they've made them clear, no-one would claim a "remake" is supposed to be part of the same story. As I illustrated above, all other wikis treat overseas remakes as separate continuities--Acer4666 (talk) 18:20, January 13, 2014 (UTC)
Even then, why must we separate it on it's own wikia? Both the UK and US version of Whose Line is it Anyway? are featured on the main site. As for this article, I would love to see a source and just because "no-one" in the past has crossed over a remake into an original story before doesn't mean it's not capable of happening now. I really wish we would not guess what the filmmakers expect of it. We've suggested treating it as separate canon before anyway.--Gunman6 (talk) 23:56, January 14, 2014 (UTC)
I don't want it on another Wikia either. Another issue we're going to have is that the second season of this will also be called Live Another Day. Silent Hunter UK (talk) 17:46, January 17, 2014 (UTC)
I'd like to revisit this, having just got hold of a subtitled copy of the Indian series. I started a new wiki here, very much a work in progress so far, but possibly a workable solution. There is certainly a nightmarish disambiguation challenge to keep it all on this wiki. However, I did briefly think of one possible solution that may be a way to keep the content all on this wiki:
Keep the continuities separate, as (I think?) we agreed to above. Work up a separate list of icons, possibly the same as we have with the 1,2,3 but with maybe an outline of india behind in a different colour, to indicate the two continuities on iu pages. For any pages that share the same name: Have another page, called PAGENAME/india, for the indian version. Then, have a set of tabs to flick between that would link to indian version/american version. I think we could make the tabs at the top not too intrusive, and it'd be a cool little way of comparing between the two shows. I've implemented a version of this on the Indian wiki here. Any thoughts?--Acer4666 (talk) 19:37, August 20, 2016 (UTC)
Well, I'm a bit concerned about having tabbers since it could affect the style of the episode pages of this wiki, but it might also be less obstructive in order to have episode articles of 24 India. BattleshipMan (talk) 22:13, August 20, 2016 (UTC)
I know it sounds odd coming from me since I've been keeping the article up to date, but I strongly feel that we should not try to cover the Indian continuity to the same degree as the U.S. one. I personally think the article as it stands is exactly the right amount of coverage - covering the production side and how the story compares to the original. It's great that there is a subtitled version out there, apparently, but even with that we can only do so much - we can't get any minor details from computers screens or background dialogue like we do for the original show, for instance. And to be honest, I don't know if the interest is there to justify such a huge undertaking - I follow the show as best I can as an interesting curiosity, but I think the focus here should remain on the flagship. I really like the alternate wiki you started - who knows, if there's enough activity there maybe we can revisit including some of it here as well.
As for the episode tabs, I see a few major issues. For episodes, that sort of breaks down with this second season, which has a completely new start time and doesn't mirror Day 2 much at all. With the changes and additions they're making (and good for them!) it's going to make even less sense to compare, say, "Day 2: 7:00am-8:00am" across series as it goes along. For characters, while some have obvious counterparts some now have two or more - Tony has disappeared and is now being played by a character who also does some of Chase's work. I like the idea in principle but I don't know if it's possible to address these - and putting the tabs right at the top, IMO, gives undue prominence to the remake in general. The nearest comparison I can think of is how Wookieepedia includes Star Wars' two continuities, and this doesn't seem nearly as justifiable. --Pyramidhead (talk) 04:48, August 21, 2016 (UTC))
To coin a phrase (no offense intended :P) but I think we need to decide whether to "shit or get off the pot" with the Indian series on this wiki!
Deliberately restricting ourselves to covering something, but not in very much detail, really sits wrong with me. I addressed this because I was tired of having some Indian actor/crew articles but not all of them, and having all of the season 1 characters' BGIN taken up with a big picture of their Indian counterpart. If we have some Indian 24 info here, people will try to add more, and there is certainly the interest (from me at least) to cover the show in at least close to the detail we cover it here. I have got some minor info from computer screens already ;) I think the argument for not covering it could also be applied to the novels and mobile games etc. The Indian show is certainly more popular and prominent than some of the EU material we cover in explicit detail. As proudhug said, this wiki was set up to cover any and all official 24 information.
To address the tab issues - to be clear, this would strictly be an alternative way of disambiguating. I realise the Season 2 stuff will diverge, but I still think it would be interesting to have the tabs there to compare how they diverge. The characters will not be an issue, as we would never have to disambiguate their names (they would just have a BGIN explaining the counterpart with a (non-external!) link to it). The only in universe articles this would be used on are things like "Thailand" or "India" etc as disambiguation. The tabs take up the same amount of vertical space as a disambiguation tag - I think with articles like Max we're giving undue prominence to the once-mentioned Day 4 Max by linking him right at the top, but it's a necessary thing to have. The star wars example looks bad, yes, because on loading the page I can't see any content - but my solution would be a lot less intrusive.--Acer4666 (talk) 08:51, August 21, 2016 (UTC)
I've implemented this in the sandbox here to get an idea of how it would actually look with all our custom js etc. It's here - and there'sa picture below comparing the two season 1 episode pages. I hope you'll agree it's not too intrusive to add at the top, no more so than a disambiguation tag we currently have--Acer4666 (talk) 10:03, August 21, 2016 (UTC)
Well, the problem is with having tabbbers is that it could create issues on episode pages since we will be having tabbers in the first two seasons, while the other seasons of the original 24 will not have them, which would affect the style of the episode pages of the original series. That could be a problem. BattleshipMan (talk) 14:10, August 21, 2016 (UTC)
All the tabbers would be is a neater way to do disambiguation. I think they're better than disambiguation tags (something we already use, and something which already causes style inconsistency between pages with them and without them). Apart from the specific issues you have with the tabbers visual style Battleshipman, are you otherwise opposed to having 24 indian wiki content on this wiki? Do you have a proposed alternative solution?--Acer4666 (talk) 15:01, August 21, 2016 (UTC)
No, Acer. I do not have an alternative solution to add 24 Indian wiki content. BattleshipMan (talk) 15:22, August 21, 2016 (UTC)

Fair points... I just worry that the language/cultural barrier will keep us from getting to the same standard we've been trying to keep with all the other articles. You're probably right that it has more fans than your average 24 novel - but they're much less... obscure? easier to obtain? to the vast majority of people who read and contribute here. I argued in favor of the status quo because I think that's the best we can reasonably do under the circumstances, without relying heavily on suspect third-party sources - but I could be wrong. I'd be willing to give it a shot, I do really like the tabs on second thought, as long as we can get rid of the "/Indian" part in the title like on wookieepedia. Also how is Category:World of 24 going to work now? Will there be a mirror category for the new articles? --Pyramidhead (talk) 19:16, August 21, 2016 (UTC)

On another OCD topic - I haven't seen the Indian series use the "Day 2" phrase anywhere, hence why I titled them "Season 2:" instead. --Pyramidhead (talk) 19:30, August 21, 2016 (UTC)
Cool! Do you have a preference for a better way to disambiguate? I quite liked having the Indian pages as "subpages" of the american version, like with the Weapons on 24 subpages, but would you prefer "(Indian)" after the titles? I just find the brackets quite clunky myself.
Have you seen the Indian episodes called "Season X:" anywhere? I definitely think that splitting them by "Day/Season" for American/Indian is a bad idea: We need some clear indication of the Indian version in the titles, as someone could easily get confused on "Season 2: 12:00am-1:00am" with no info on the original season. I think keeping episode titles the same but with some sort of Indian tag in the title is the way to go.
I would think mirror categories for any "world of 24" ones that warrant it would work. I'd start just with the very necessary categs ("Indian series characters", "Indian Day 1 characters" or some similar disambig) and then assess if we need/can justify in-universe ones too.--Acer4666 (talk) 22:30, August 21, 2016 (UTC)
I like the tabs, I just want it so when you go to Day 1: 12:00am-1:00am/India it hides the "/India" part in the header. The Star Wars wiki does that with "/Legends" pages --Pyramidhead (talk) 22:52, August 21, 2016 (UTC)
Also, I assume you ordered this? I've been searching for (ahem) other sources but come up dry. --Pyramidhead (talk) 01:25, August 22, 2016 (UTC)
Ah, so just get rid of India with DISPLAYTITLE? Yeah thats easy enough to do and it's instantly obvious from the tabs that someone's on the Indian version of the article.
Yeah, thats the DVD set I got. Cost a fair bit to import! Are you able to (ahem) acquire a non-subtitled version (I did a quick scout which suggests you can). No promises, but I may be able to send you the srt subtitle files so you can marry them up and watch too--Acer4666 (talk) 07:53, August 22, 2016 (UTC)
So, just to get up to speed... are we already settled on NOT using another wiki, but using tabs for disambiguation? How are we going to deal with the issues that were brought up above at some point like episodes that don't pair with each other (for example, are we going to pair first episode with first episode, regardless of timeframes... or pair them according to the plot?), or characters that are split into two in the Indian version, etc. etc. I just want to get a clear picture of the procedures. Thief12 (talk) 02:52, August 23, 2016 (UTC)
I don't think anything's settled yet - but my understanding is
  • There will be some alternate IU categories - something like Characters/India, Locations/India - to cover IU topics like we do for the main series
  • Tabs will be used for identically titled episodes and IU pages that carry over to both (Mumbai, Thailand, etc.) but not for analogue characters
We definitely need to establish exactly how all this is going to work before doing anything. And to be honest I'm once again a little leery; I've been trying to locate good quality videos for the first season and come up empty. It will feel a little hard to contribute without being able to scrutinize and take screencaps like I normally can --Pyramidhead (talk) 03:30, August 23, 2016 (UTC)
Yeah I think that's the plan. The "/India" and tabs would just be a neater way of disambiguating pages with the same name (without the little typed out italics blurbs), and the fact that episodes are paired and you're able to compare like for like in the first season is a nice little side effect (but that won't be as prominent in later seasons).
Pyramidhead are your concerns that you won't be able to contribute as much? I'd very much like you to be able to contribute, and I'll try and help you out as much as I can so that you are able to, but I don't think we should make policy decisions based on whether you can--Acer4666 (talk) 08:44, August 23, 2016 (UTC)
It's not about me - it's the fact that, at the moment, only one editor we know of has subtitled episodes, and it's apparently very difficult for anyone else to get them. --Pyramidhead (talk) 18:44, August 23, 2016 (UTC)
I'm trying to establish long term inclusion policy for this wiki, so the current number of editors at the minute with subtitles isn't really relevant. I'll happily share the subtitle srt files with anyone who wants them. I mean, living in Britain, I (and all other British editors) are unable to get a copy of the Season 1 special edition with the deleted scenes and extra features - but I'm not going to argue against including the info here. The information exists, and if someone wants to add it we shouldn't stop that info being added because not all of us can.--Acer4666 (talk) 19:41, August 23, 2016 (UTC)
If we had someone from India who is a fan of 24 India, it would be easier for us to understand it. That's for sure. Like Acer said, what we need is to find a way a decent way to establish a long term inclusion policy on 24 India stuff. Also like Pyramidhead said, we need to find decent screencaps of that version and we need to find a way to solve some disambiguating issues of 24 India, so we won't have to use italics on top of those articles, like Acer said. BattleshipMan (talk) 19:54, August 23, 2016 (UTC)

Categories Edit

I'm not totally convinced that slashing every possible category is the way to go. I noticed that StarWars.wikia groups together both Canon and Legends pages in the appropriate category - that is, it doesn't matter whether a planet is canon or retconned, it still goes under Category:Planets. I feel this might be a better approach for IU pages - it just looks odd to see "/India" after every cat and it can't really be hidden the way the page title can. At the very least, I think it might be better to use parentheses for category names, much more in keeping with the rest of the site. Maybe: Season 1 (India) characters, Season 1 (India) locations, etc. --Pyramidhead (talk) 19:44, August 29, 2016 (UTC)

Yeah, I agree with this. I think it was my original intention to not do the slashing for categories (the reason for the slashing at all was the idea of "subpages") and that must've got lost in my head along the way. What about just an (India) tag after everything: "Day 1 characters (India)", "Season 1 crew (India)", "Living characters (India)" etc.? I'm not too sure about mixing in the two continuities in the same category - perhaps if the situation comes up we could discuss exactly what we would be mixing--Acer4666 (talk) 20:19, August 29, 2016 (UTC)
The mixed categories would be basically all the ones under World of 24 except for the season-specific ones. The continuities will still be separated in all the ways that matter - no referencing Thailand's story role on the OG page, etc - but Countries in Asia will include both Thailand and Thailand/India. It's imperfect but at the end of the day it's all fictional subjects anyway - and the alternative, taken to its logical conclusion, entails ridiculous categories like Federal agents (India), Terminology (India), Countries in Europe (India)... --Pyramidhead (talk) 20:32, August 29, 2016 (UTC)
Well, hopefully, we can find the categories that will easy for the 24/India show without any issues in this wiki. BattleshipMan (talk) 20:40, August 29, 2016 (UTC)
My feeling on including the Indian stuff is that it shouldn't be at the detriment of anyone wanting to browse stuff solely based on the original show. An "optional extra" sort of thing. But doing this mixing is making it impossible for someone who wants to browse these cats who is only interested in the original - because it'll be impossible to distinguish which pages are Indian version and which are Original version.
I don't think ridiculous categories is the logical conclusion - we'd only make categories if there were enough to warrant it (not just mirror every single OG cat). So, we'd just have the bare basic cats then assess which extra World of 24 ones warrant being created. We can have the Indian ones as subcats of the OG ones, so they're still all together for anyone who wants to browse through all, but have a separation for those that don't want to. So we would just have "countries (India)" unless enough came along to warrant splitting them into continents--Acer4666 (talk) 20:41, August 29, 2016 (UTC)
That works for me - though we'll still have the problem of "(India)" after every single category at the end. There are relatively so few characters, locations, etc. for the Indian show right now I don't think it would cause confusion to just combine the categories. Also I think we may be overestimating how concerned the average reader is with matters of continuity - we're the types to get worked up over retconned fighter jets, sure, but would a layperson who came across Jai Singh Rathod while browsing Characters really be all that upset? Putting aside the silliness of the exact same events happening on two continents, the two shows for all intents and purposes might as well be in the same universe - no outright conflicts yet that I know of. As long as it's made clear on the articles themselves that they're separate I don't see the problem personally -Pyramidhead (talk) 21:01, August 29, 2016 (UTC)
I generally try to remember back when I stumbled across this wiki when I was just a "casual fan", before getting too obsessed with the show. It did irk me that there was a mix of info from the show I was a fan of, and then info from the spin-off books and things, and often wasn't a way to distinguish what info was what (see this post from back before I became a proper contributor here). Maybe that's just my OCD brain, but I think that some casual browsers may feel the same.
On the flipside, mixing in the indian characters with all the rest also means it's impossible to get a list of the Indian-series characters, which also may be of interest (definitely is for me!). I think the fact we have "(Indian)" after the categories isn't such a terrible price to pay to having separate continuities in separate cats--Acer4666 (talk) 22:14, August 29, 2016 (UTC)
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