Forum:What counts as a name

Forum: The Situation Room > What counts as a name

I know there has been a debate on this at Talk:Alpha 7, but I'd like to clear up exactly what we classing as a name for the purposes of creating articles/unnamed characters. I don't particularly follow the logic on that linked talk page, and don't agree that there is such a difference between a police call sign and a conspirator's codename that we would treat them differently, but even if there was I still see inconsistencies -

• I see no absolutely no difference between Cabal 5 and Alpha 7, yet one is unnamed and the other is not;
• Again, I don't see the distinction between Agents Dos and Ocho, and officer 1-M-38 yet again we have treated them differently.

I feel like we should make a decision to either give all these characters articles, or treat them all as unnamed.--Acer4666 (talk) 18:44, January 23, 2016 (UTC)

Wasn't "Cabal 5" just from the credits - definitely don't remember ever hearing that spoken in dialogue. I'd rather rename that to "Female cabal member." Other than that I'd lean toward giving them articles. The list should be for people who have no IU name of any kind. --Pyramidhead (talk) 20:09, January 23, 2016 (UTC)

Is "5" less legitimate than "A7"?

True, but "5" was her pseudonym within the cabal and was how the other members knew her. I don't see how it's any different to someone being known as "A7" to his fellow conspirator Nathanson--Acer4666 (talk) 20:44, January 23, 2016 (UTC)

For that matter, I can't remember "cabal" being used outside of the credits. I don't know if "5" on the screen combined with an arbitrary word is enough to put together a name. Anyway - in the other cases I would be okay with giving them their own articles. Just write it something like:

1-Mary-38 was the radio call sign of a LAPD officer - etc. --Pyramidhead (talk) 21:02, January 23, 2016 (UTC)

Why would we not create an article "5", then? I really don't see how it differs from "A7", they were both identified as such in-universe--Acer4666 (talk) 21:09, January 23, 2016 (UTC)

Hehe. I get what you're saying, just seems a little more of a reach than Alpha 7 - for all we know the Red Dot software randomizes their numbers every time so no one can try to pick up on who each person is. If we apply the standard equally, though, I guess that would qualify for a new article. I'm always looking for excuses to start new pages, so I wouldn't be opposed --Pyramidhead (talk) 21:19, January 23, 2016 (UTC)

Per the Canon policy, we are perfectly fine to continue to use "Cabal 5" as that character's name. Since Alpha 7 already has an article, now that you guys mention it, there is really no reason why Cabal 5 cannot have her own too. Blue Rook  talk  contribs 01:17, February 12, 2016 (UTC)

I was thinking that, but if we start accepting things like Alpha 7 and Cabal 5 as "names", then what is stopping "The Handler" or "FBI agent #2" or all other credited identifiers? In my opinion, these things are not names at all. I still don't see the distinction between Alpha 7 and 1-Mary-38, the fact that one is used to hide an identity and one is used for another functional purpose is kind of insignificant. It's true we have other aliases like Mandy etc., but we also have other functional nicknames- eg Ferg isn't that person's real name but it's something they call themselves to make their name easier for people to say. It's not trying to hide their identity, but it's for the same functional purpose as a police officer calling themselves 1-Mary-38. But one is a name and the other is not--Acer4666 (talk) 15:26, February 14, 2016 (UTC)

Before I comment, I'd like to ask, what were the circumstances under which both "Cabal 5" and "Alpha-7" were used? I don't have the seasons on me now, but was "Cabal 5" ever identified like that, or was it just the number on the screen and then the credits? did "Alpha-7" answer the phone like that, or did Nathanson ever call him that? or was it just the credits? Did someone else call him "Alpha-7" through the episode? I just want to clarify the facts. Thief12 (talk) 16:28, February 14, 2016 (UTC)

Cabal 5 was just the number on the screen and then the end credits. The other guy said "alpha 7" when he picked up the phone, and was just credited as "the man".--Acer4666 (talk) 16:38, February 14, 2016 (UTC)

If that was the extent of the use of both "names", then I think Cabal 5 is in the appropriate place (Unnamed terrorists), and I would have no problem moving "Alpha 7" there as well. After all, we don't even know if that was the name he was known by. Maybe it was a password he knew he had to give when answering :-D Thief12 (talk) 16:49, February 14, 2016 (UTC)

I'm not able to follow the reasoning here. "Dagger", "Mandy", and "Alpha 7" are codenames. Is it because there are numbers in Alpha 7 and Cabal 5 that you guys want to move them to unnamed pages? Also I'm dumbfounded that you are trying to lump a police officer's radio call sign with the codenames of undercover operatives. I'm really not even sure how to reply to that.

Also, under no circumstances would this extend to stuff like "FBI agent #2"... that's quite silly! Blue Rook  talk  contribs 19:56, February 15, 2016 (UTC)

Mandy is a name though. Dagger and Alpha 7 are not names. I'm not trying to lump things together...I'm saying both things are not names, so shouldn't be listed as articles. If we did list them, we'd have to list all the "non name" characters in separate articles.--Acer4666 (talk) 20:13, February 15, 2016 (UTC)