Talk: Counter Terrorist Unit

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Roles in CTU need to be fixed

I noticed many flaws with the roles list, first of all I think where we have " Regional Division Director " and " Regional District Director " we should change them both to simply " Division Command " and " District Command " because it is unclear peoples posistion, we just know where there from. Like in season 1 for example when Jack met with Richard Walsh Later when Mason came and asked for info on Jack, Nina told Jamey and Tony after they both said " We should tell Mason about the keycard because Mason supersedes Jack " then Nina said " No, This was from Walsh" Then later while Ryan was questioning Jack, jack stated walsh was a " District Manager " meaning there is another type of district title, And since Mason was a confirmed Divison Director in Day 1, and if Nina said Walsh is above Mason, and when Jack stated " District Manager " obviously District is above Divison command, and from this evidence we know Walsh held some sort of district posistion, and so did Chappelle, most likely Chappelle was a District Manager during Season 1-2 and a Director in 3 because at the end of Day 2 when Tony walks up to the [Special Agent In charge's office] Ryan says " well hello my friend, that was District Director Thomas , he is pleased with our work today " also I heard Ryan call this Thomas ( generic name , I forget his real name ) the prefix " Sir " meaning Chappelle was not a Director, but most likely just a manager! WaffleStomp 20:45, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

I think you're referring to Vaughn. But yes, our CTU ranks and positions need to be fixed. Check out User:Proudhug/CTU Registry, it's one of Proudhug's user pages where anyone can contribute verbatim accounts of a CTU worker's stated rank, including DVD times of the appearance. I think you'll love that page, WaffleStomp, and I bet you have a bunch of citations that you could add to the collection, there, too. That is the page where we'll hopefully sort everything out, eventually. Blue Rook  talk  contribs 23:21, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

Featured Status

This article was one of our first FA's and was chosen basically because it was, at the time, one of the wiki's best works. There is no way on Earth we can say that it still is. Half of it is a messy and untidy list and another section is copied material. I propose this article is stripped of its FA status. --24 Administration 23:26, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

:o How mean! Just because the standards have changed, doesn't mean history should be rewritten. I agree the article would not even come close to making FA nowadays, but the truth is that it did back in the early days. I don't see any reason in stripping it of its FA status, other than to make it eligible for nomination again. And unless it's rewritten, it won't be eligible, anyway, so I think the FA status should remain. --Proudhug 23:39, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

This article may be presumably possibly not clear

Yikes! I can't believe this article was once Featured! In my opinion, it needs to be written entirely from scratch. The whole thing is riddled with OOU comments, not to mention TONS of speculation:

"It is not entirely clear what government entity is in charge of CTU..."

"It is possible that the District office oversees an entire region of the United States..."

"This may be contradicted by the conversation between Jack Bauer and George Mason..."

"The CTU substations presumably are the rough equivalent of FBI R.A's..."

"... assisted Jack Bauer in bringing in Jane Saunders were possibly part of the CTU Substation..."

"... The Substations presumably report to District and Division Commands."

Like all of our other articles, this one needs to state the known facts clearly and in context, rather than being littered with comments about what we think and what might be. --Proudhug 20:32, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

It could use a makeover. On the other hand, when it was voted to be featured, it probably got 3 votes, beating the competetion that had 2 votes.--CWY2190^talkcontribs 21:01, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

Cubsfan2007 got most of it, and I just killed the rest. Blue Rook  talk  contribs 23:42, 7 December 2008 (UTC)

Map

How about a map shopwing the locations of CTUs in the US? --220.233.124.201 11:36, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

Agency

I'll change it for now... hasn't it been proven that CTU is part of the Agency? Mason said to Nina during interrogation, "How long have you been with the Agency...", so it is deduced there. Also, that is the logical place to put CTU and I'm almost positive that there are other references, I just can't think of them --BauerJ24 03:00, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

Yes, according to the novels, CTU is a part of the CIA. I assume that's the "Agency" to which you refer. --Proudhug 03:02, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

IU/OOU

The entire first section of this article, "Position Within the U.S. Government", is written from an out-of-universe perspective, and needs to be removed, entirely rewritten, or moved to the end of the article as "Background information". --Proudhug 20:52, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

There are all kinds of out-of-universe details in the "in-universe" pages already. Tony Almeida was played by Carlos Bernard? Day 1, Day 2, Day 3? Are you saying all of that is background information? Because I'm pretty sure Tony Almeida didn't "appear" at CTU on an hourly basis.

The in-universe/out-of-universe distinction is useful enough to illustrate which verb tense to use, but ultimately Wiki24 is a repository of information about the show. It's innately out-of-universe, and insisting that pages be written from an in-universe perspective serves no function with respect to informing the reader. We can ask ourselves whether Jack Bauer would understand the pages on the site, but what's the point? --StBacchus 05:28, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

While this is a wiki related to 24, and as such, in-universe info takes precedence, I think for an article such as CTU, having a general overview as to how the CTU would work in real life could be of benefit to the reader, informing them just where CTU sits within the forces of counter-terrorism. That's my two cents anyway. Steve C // talk // email // 00:21, 29 August 2008 (UTC)

Sure there are tons of things we could include here that would be useful, but most of them fall outside the goals of the site, which is to archive all known facts about 24. I think your idea is one that would fall outside of these goals. If it did exist, it would be better suited in an OOU article, but I still don't see how it has any place in an encyclopedia. It seems to me it would be composed entirely of educated speculation and/or borderline fan fiction. --Proudhug 01:03, 29 August 2008 (UTC)

Thank GOD this has finally been done. Excellent work, that template at the top has bugged me forever. --SignorSimon _{(talk/contribs/email)} 22:56, 7 December 2008 (UTC)

Hah yeah, Cubsfan2007 earned our respect! And to think this has been an FA all along... as CWY2190 said, it probably won by a mere handful of votes back then, but I can't even find the ballots in the FA vote page history. Blue Rook  talk  contribs 23:42, 7 December 2008 (UTC)

I think, back when it was chosen, it was just 24 Administration picking an FA and putting it on the front page. We didn't have enough editors at the time to actually have votes, so he just chose them (because the site was new, and it was the off-season). Then we started the nomination/voting process later. Ah the days of yore! --Proudhug 02:03, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

Counter Terrorism Unit

When was it referred to as Conunter Terrorism Unit? Moridin12 21:18, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

I assume you're talking about Counter Terrorism Unit and made a typo. :D God don't get me started on what it stands for lol. The logo says Counter Terrorist Unit but on numerous occasions, characters have used Terrorism. --24 Administration 22:55, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

Is there any examples of this that anyone knows off the bat? Moridin12 16:18, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

The only instance I can think of off-hand is on the first page of One Shot. I do get a chuckle every time I hear Kate say "Counter Terrism Agency?" --Proudhug 17:14, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

I actually said Terrorism yesterday, explaining the show to someone who had never seen it. It kinda slips off the tongue. O_o --StBacchus 18:02, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

Really? I find it really awkward to say. It's got that extra syllable in there. Come to think of it, whenever I say the name outloud, I usually lazily pronounce it "Counter Terrace Unit". As if Jack and the others are out there putting a stop to balconies. --Proudhug 18:23, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

I can so relate to that Moridin12 20:27, 2 August 2006 (UTC)

I know that this is a kind of old discussion, but I just wanted to trhow out the fact that in Cat's Claw, Ayman Al-Libbi pronounced it as Counter Terrorism Unit. - Tyminator1 (Talk) 03:19, November 25, 2009 (UTC)

First Section

The entire first section needs to be re-written still. I'm not sure what to put there but we can't just have these quotes from books. Any ideas anyone? --24 Administration 20:20, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

Simply paraphrasing the book information would suffice, methinks. --24.57.166.160 00:03, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Disbandment

I added Nina Myers to the list of cold blooded murders committed by Jack Bauer. This is beacuse if we're going to consider the death of a very minor character such as Goren, we should consider the death of a major chaarcter as well, especially someone who had had such a large influence on the programme and whose death was morally ambigous.Skycloud86 23:35, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

Established in 1993?

What's the source for this? I don't recall any year being mentioned about that. Blue Rook  talk  contribs 22:40, February 10, 2010 (UTC)

Understanding How CTU Functions

First of all I need more clarity about CTU's position as a governmental function. If it functions under the CIA there is a distinct and clear issue of constitutionality involved with intelligence collection on US persons, both domestic and abroad. Furthermore, CIA does not have domestic primacy under any circumstance; this is relegated to the FBI. Furthermore, they are not a law enforcement agency and thus do not have arrest authority, such as that of the FBI. It is very clear they do not function within the legal guidelines of proper court procedure, whether it be under normal court procedures or those granted via FISA or the Patriot Act, which grant greater authorities to the federal government but do not minimize the rights and powers of US citizens. In addition, if CTU is a part of domestic counter-terrorist operations it would clearly fall under the Department of Justice or the Department of Homeland Security. Under most circumstances seen in the series they have superseded event the bounds of those two departments, by taking control of and orchestrating the actions of the LA Police Department and for the most part other local and state law enforcement agencies. There are distinct rules and processes that grant the federal government primacy over any local or state government, which must be initiated by an Executive Order, such as that of martial law. This has happened very infrequently, and at that time it would become an issue of the Department of Defense and in the case of a CBRNE incident a FEMA/EPA issue to be addressed.

Second, if CTU is a part of the Department of Defense, then at no point in time would the CIA or other agency, to include the Department of Justice or Department of Homeland Security, have authority over this agency. It is a distinct separation of organizations instituted on purpose by the constitution to ensure no one organization had complete control. Furthermore, under this if CTU was a part of another department, Department of Defense would have absolutely no authority, other than that granted by an Executive Order, to take control of CTU and run its operations.

It must be made clear that for those who believe that CTU or an entity like it exists they would be gravely mistake and should go back to a basic political science course that discusses how our country's organizations function and the necessity to separate their duties in order to maintain US citizen's rights as granted by the Bill of Rights. These rights have many times been broken and trampled on in the series as the use of torture was a routine process to acquire information. I do not have a fundamental issue with the use of non-evasive methods of torture if employed in a controlled and legitimate environment and used against non-US persons, but if the employment of such tactics are to be used against US citizens then there is a HUGE problem, most of all is the violation of their rights to due process.

I think the show needs to make up its mind in determining if it is a law enforcement agency, intelligence agency or a military agency. It cannot be all at the same time, otherwise why have any of them.

Finally, any agency with as many moles and people playing against the mission of the agency should be immediately dismantled, and persons prosecuted for at least breaches of security. Any agency that allows anybody to come into its operations center with at the most an escort, to include persons of possible terrorist or treasonous purposes, should be shut down immediately and security clearances revoked. I know that Secret and especially Top Secret level information that is displayed openly is in a confined area that does not allow for any visible access to those not cleared to see it. CTU is also not well constructed if you can make a cell phone call from the operations center without a problem getting out. Why and how anybody could be allowed to take any outside electronics devices into a SCIF is beyond me.

OK, I'm off my soap box. I hope somebody can enlighten me about the show on where I am missing the connections.

First, understand this is a talk page for an article of this encyclopedia, not a general interest discussion board about stuff on 24. Strictly speaking, anyone can remove your post because it's completely unrelated to our article here about CTU but rather is a digression about CTU. Talk pages are for discussing the improvement of the project only.

But to address what you're asking anyway, you're forgetting something: this is fiction. Discussing the legal impossibility of such an organization as CTU is just as fruitful as arguing how no single man could ever save Los Angeles from not one... not two... but four nuclear strikes like Jack Bauer has done over the course of the series. It's also only slightly more useful than talking about why lightsabers in Star Wars can't exist in the real world. It's all fake. We suspend our belief for fiction in order to enjoy the entertainment value of shows like this.

Also, you say that it "must be made clear that for those who believe that CTU or an entity like it exists". Certainly, no one of an adult intelligence level believes that CTU is real. Even if they did, it is not the purpose of this 24 encyclopedia to clarify when the show deviates from real life. Every second of the show is a deviation from reality! Blue Rook  talk  contribs 03:33, February 23, 2010 (UTC)

Fair enough. Feel free to remove it. Thanks.

Vandalism

Is there a way you could lock this page to stop all the vandalism that seems to appear on this page? Scott.mck 07:06, March 29, 2012 (UTC)

We can lock pages if vandalism becomes a major problem, but I don't think we're quite there yet. It's easier just to revert and ignore!--Acer4666 (talk) 09:18, March 29, 2012 (UTC)

Scott, there are no pages as far as I know protected here, while they have been vandalized multiple times. They can off course being protected, semi-protected. But the thing is, since 24 is over, it doesn't actually matter here if pages are protected or not. 24 is over, so protecting is unneeded, however, sometimes pages are vandalized and they actually should being protected. But as you know, I'm not an administrator. Insetad of ignoring, I would put a note on their talk page or either block them. --Station7 14:17, March 29, 2012 (UTC)

24 is over!? Ha! Oh, how nieve. Don't you know it will never die! 24 is the Highlander!!! - BlackWidower (talk) 03:35, March 5, 2017 (UTC)

New Logo

Does anyone have a source for the new CTU logo from Legacy? I know we need a clean version, not taken from the show's footage. Anyone got an idea for that? Because the current logo is out of date. - BlackWidower (talk) 03:34, March 5, 2017 (UTC)