Talk:David Emerson

Who shot Emerson the second time?

According to this page, it was Jack. According to many others, including the Fox site, it was Tony. I'm inclined to go with Tony as well; it's rather unlike 24 to edit a scene like that, where it isn't totally clear that Jack was the shooter. Unless, of course, it was indeed Tony who delivered the kill shot. Plus, Tony clearly saw Emerson aim his gun at him. Why WOULDN'T he shoot again? --G-reaper 03:03, 4 February 2009 (UTC)

After I watched the scene again, I had this discussion. I still believe it was Jack's kill, but this is a wiki and the discussion is always open. Please post your reply right over there, though, so the discussion can remain in one spot! Blue Rook  talk  contribs 03:22, 4 February 2009 (UTC)

It was definitely a Tony kill IMO, though I could see a case being made either way due to the way it was edited. It's very subtle and quick but if you look closely Jack was just then picking himself up off the floor and turning around with the gun after the second shot was fired. And shortly after in the episode they showed Tony talking to Emerson - if Jack had shot him from that angle straight on, the bullet would've went right through one side of his neck and out the other, but there was no wound there. Also, the Bauercount folks didn't list it as a Jack kill either and they're pretty good at figuring this stuff out. SeanPM 03:51, 4 February 2009 (UTC)

I rest my case that it was a Jack kill. I've seen the episode three or four times, and it would make no sense if Tony had shot him. Here are four reasons:

• Weapon: When Emerson approached Jack, he took his gun and dropped it on the floor. After Tony shot him the first time, Jack falls and is seen crawling towards the area where Emerson had dropped his gun.
• Motive: Emerson was about to shoot Tony, and he had already hesitated to shoot him the first time. Jack had obviously more resolve to kill Emerson than Tony had already showed because of his emotional involvement with Emerson.
• Angle and direction of the shot: The shot clearly comes from the side from where Jack fell. If Tony had shot, I don't see why they wouldn't have put the shot in the head or the chest. I mean, most of these heroes are pretty good aims. It makes no sense for Tony to shoot him in the side of the neck.
• Directing and purpose of the gunshot and the scene overall: Who would the writers put to shoot Emerson? Tony? Tony had an obvious emotional/fraternal relationship with Emerson and he had already hesitated to shoot him first. Sure, Emerson was about to shoot him, but then why not have Tony shoot him in the front and not on the specific side of the neck. If Tony was shooting to kill, then why not put the shot in the head or chest? And if he was shooting only to injure Emerson, why not in the leg or arm again, instead of the side of the neck which would probably end in a critical injury? Moreover, if the purpose was to have Tony shoot the man that he said was like a brother, why the director doesn't focus on his reaction after the shot? I mean, if you're going to stress the emotional aspect of it, why not highlight it. Instead, as Emerson gets shot, the camera cuts to Jack who's getting up, gun in hand, pointing in the same direction where Emerson was shot.

I think that's enough evidence to convince me that it was Jack's kill. Then again, I might be wrong and giving too much thought to something that's not worth it, but well. Thief12 13:44, 4 February 2009 (UTC)

I tend to agree with Thief12, especially on the Motive part. Also, Bauercount has errors and inconsistencies that I know to be incorrect. They do great work, and I've posted there before, but they aren't a source of canon. To answer G-reaper's closing question, Tony held back from shooting because of his connection with Emerson. He was almost crying when Emerson was dying and when he refused to forgive Tony. Remember that Emerson literally raised Tony from the dead!

On this topic, I'm glad a good debate has finally come up on the wiki, and also that everyone is perfectly civil. We've been overdue for a good debate on show content like this! Blue Rook  talk  contribs 19:26, 4 February 2009 (UTC)

This isn't settled. Perhaps Tony really did kill Emerson: can someone check the scene again? I can't tell on the Hulu version, but I think there's a chance that we see Tony's pistol flash. Blue Rook  talk  contribs 16:57, 13 February 2009 (UTC)

I can check it again, but I've already stated my opinion, and it would be good if someone else does it. For what it's worth, I saw the scene several times and there's no such thing as a flash from Tony's pistol. As a matter of fact, the camera doesn't even show Tony for a good while after Emerson is shot. It only cuts to Jack who's just standing up gun in hand. Thief12 04:45, 14 February 2009 (UTC)

I don't follow what you're saying. The camera is on Tony when the gunshot is heard. And I think I'm seeing a flash from his pistol. (You mentioned something about Tony after the gunshot.) Blue Rook  talk  contribs 05:19, 14 February 2009 (UTC)

No. The camera is on Emerson when he gets shot. After you see he gets shot, the camera cuts to Jack and doesn't go to Tony for awhile. Thief12 05:25, 14 February 2009 (UTC)

Jack fell to Emerson's left and was going for his gun when the second shot happened. Plus, in the very next shot of Jack that we see, he's still getting to his feet and readying his gun, and he looks surprised to hear the second gunshot. On another note, I think the conversation Tony and Emerson had later indicated that Tony was the one who dealt the killing blow; I don't think Tony would have been so remorseful if it was Jack who had been the one to do it. Finally, again, the FOX website indicates that it was Tony who did it, and under the circumstances, I'm inclined to go with them on this one. --Pyramidhead 00:28, 11 March 2009 (UTC)

Can you provide a link? Thief12 12:36, 11 March 2009 (UTC)

The website Pyramidhead is talking about is this one, I think, just click the 1pm summary. But putting that aside for the moment anyway, Thief I think your assessment is mistaken. As evident from my first post on this thread, I believed it was Jack's kill too, but now I think we're the victim of extremely bad editing. Jack had only a supporting role in that scene, and the person who had the most ability and reason to take that shot was Tony, not Jack. The reason is this: it was Tony's true moment of revelation and purpose, undoing all the evil stuff he had done up to that point and proving his motivations finally. The emotional impact of that whole scene was Tony's willingness to even kill the man who resurrected him from death, a man that was like his brother for years... simply for the purpose of doing the right thing.

In addition to that, the gunshot was a through-the-front-and-out-the-back-side-of-the-neck wound. That effect really doesn't strike me as a shot entering from the side and below, where Jack was. It looked rather similar to the Curtis kill, which was also from the front. Entry wounds originating from the side are never depicted that way on the show, and I'm pretty sure it wouldn't have looked that way in real life either. Again, just a case of confusing editing. They showed Jack rising up and aiming because, even though that was Tony's scene, it's Jack's show and he is never depicted as being incapacitated for more than a few seconds. Blue Rook  talk  contribs 15:29, 11 March 2009 (UTC)

Yeah, like you said, it's probably all because of the bad editing. I can't fight the original source (FOX), so I suppose we can all agree it was Tony's kill. Thief12 16:01, 11 March 2009 (UTC)

I finally got around to rewatching the scene today, and I totally agree with Blue Rook on this. Because of the way it's edited, it could be argued that Jack may have shot Emerson, however that makes no sense from a story perspective. I think the scene was clearly written to illustrate Tony's betrayal of Emerson by having him kill him. The Fox.com recap merely says that Tony shot Emerson (which he undisputedly did the first time), but makes no reference at all to a second shot, from either Tony or Jack. --Proudhug 17:29, 11 March 2009 (UTC)